average player rake

[zaghomat]

Anybody has some data on how much rake an average player generate? an afiliate manager et Everest poker told me it's 500$/lifetime on average.

[Jeremy]

The average lifetime player rake (also known as player value) will vary substantially depending on the room. A room like PokerStars for example, will be exponentially higher than a small start-up site with no player liquidity.

$500 would seem very low for one of the top 5 rooms, and very high for a smaller room.

Also as an affiliate, you would need a very large sample size to get an accurate overall value.

[zaghomat]

Everest is the 4th biggest independant room, but it's a relatively new room so their stats might not be accurate. Any stats on the major site?

[PPP]

Everest has been around 3+ years which isn't "new" in this business, nor is it one of the 2001 rooms. It's also neither the largest nor the smallest room. It may not be the most typical room, but in many ways it does seem like a good pick as an "average" room.

[stiankr]

This tells me: go for CPA on the new rooms and MGR on the more established ones. Any opinions?

[PPP]

Originally Posted by stiankr

This tells me: go for CPA on the new rooms and MGR on the more established ones. Any opinions?

Unless you expect to be out of the business in six months, you should go for what builds you stronger business relationships for the longterm with the cardrooms. In all cases this is to send players to cardrooms where it is plainly profitable for the cardroom.

[scrawnybob]

hi

not sure that other more experience affilaliate would agree but I now go for MGR everytime where I can

the way I look at it is I have no control over the quality of the players I might send - obviously with a room that you send a decent amount of players to on CPA they will know if your sending decent players (you wont) on MGR you both know

with CPA you get the money up front and the room is taking the risk not you - but speak to them

say look I'd rather share the risk and get to know you and work with you - so you treat me better - and we both win or lose together

I think for new affiliates just thinking about the biggest CPA you can get doesnt help to get the room onside

but doing CPA through PAW is a good solution - afaiks so long as the PAW average player value is good (and your not sending fraud players) then you benefit from the averaging of a bigger pool of stats

which is something a small / new affiliate doesnt have alone

in terms of average player value - that can be an average of some pretty extreme differences -

you'll get a few players happily raking $xxxx at one end and a hell of alot at the other who seem to be able to lose $50 -$100 making the absolute minimum rake possible like 50 cents (I mean I cant figure out how they could lose so efficiently but they do)

cheers scrawnybob

[zaghomat]

So for exemple, If Everest propose you a CPA of 200$ or a MGR of 25%, what would you choose?

[SunPoker.com]

Also, I have seen big swings in lifetime player value from players in different parts of the world, and even different countries.

For instance, I know Sunpoker has very high lifetime player values from certain countries and other countries have very low lifetime player values. I would also keep that in mind when you guys are marketing to different parts of the world or where you are targeting your advertising.

Mark

[kaus]

Originally Posted by stiankr

This tells me: go for CPA on the new rooms and MGR on the more established ones. Any opinions?

I dont think your going to find you will do very well asking for CPA from the smaller rooms. For starters unless you have built a relationship with them they probably wont give you a second thought as I have experienced...if they do how quick are they to yank you off the progam when you can't do what they require.

I found the small rooms are less likely to give it to you unless they see your putting the effort into them. I asked for CPA from one room last winter...was turned down very quick with "we dont do CPA" and they dont I know that, I asked again the other night and we're discussing the details.

Do I want CPA for everyroom...no This one is different because it can be unpredictable if the players will stay or go. I could still lose out in the long run. I have seen some small rooms attract more players for me than others.

An example I leased pages to rooms to supplement income for advertising expenses. I agree to x amount of depositing players with min deposit for 3 mths or whatever. Yeah it seems like it can be a great deal, I get my money upfront and I work for them till our agreement is finished. I had more RMP at that room in two weeks than I had elsewhere. Your taking a risk and possibly losing out ...fortunatly with that room I was able to see the stats as if I was on MGR so I know not to take that deal again.

If I could there would be three rooms that I would take CPA, the others would be MGR.

Also want to add I think you should get to know the rooms as well and how player retention is and things like that before deciding. I immediatly jumped on CPA for Bodog and wish I didnt, and there a couple of others that I wish I wasn't in such a rush when I decided which program i was going to go with.